Clan Population Cap?

Morgan

26-07-2007 06:51:39

I was just wondering... is there a clan population cap? If not, should there be? I mean, since the Exodus, we've lost a clan, and way things are going, we could lose another, but our population has to be greater now then a few years ago. So, would it be better to have a clan population cap? I mean some clans have more and less then others (Not whining :P). It'd also encourage the removal of inactive members if a clan hit the cap, just so they could fit in actives.

Anyway, just wondering... :P

Anshar

26-07-2007 12:30:59

There is no clan population cap that I am aware of; back when it was first created, CP had something like 150 members (give or take).

Clans should keep their rosters clean of inactive members, but each clan has to make that determination on when they decide to remove inactive members. Still, with Envoys/Rollmasters, AEDs, QUAs, PCONs, and CONs all watching various clan rosters, inactive members should be out the door pretty quickly. Clan sizes will always fluctuate as new members come in and people transfer between them. The database is set up to assign new members to clans on a rotational basis (Tar gets this one, Taly gets the next one, and so on).

What exactly do you mean by "the way things are going, we could lose another?" Whatever problems exist in the clans now probably can't be solved by having a population cap for clan size.

Andan Taldrya Marshall

26-07-2007 15:22:08

No and no. AFAIK the database spreads out new members between clans so unless you get a crappy leader in one of them that doesn't do their job, which causes a loss of members either through transfers out or AWOLs, then all the clans should be getting relatively equal numbers of APPs.

I don't see why a cap would make any sense with the current situation. Your argument is more or less that we're having problems filling our rosters. If we are having those problems then wouldn't it make sense to let as many people in as possible, rather then turn away potentially active members just because the clan has "too many" people?

Anshar

26-07-2007 17:49:28

My understanding of the database could be a bit off, but the ultimate point is that, one way or the other, it does keep things as even as possible. Of course, direct recruits go to the clan of the person who recruited them.

Khobai

27-07-2007 09:47:03

Clans that suck deserve to be shut down. And yes that means Plagueis :P

Anshar

27-07-2007 17:16:43

Well, you know Khobs, some vile miscreants decided to close down Qel-Droma, too. We should make them suffer :P

Morgan

29-07-2007 14:34:21

I thought Halc closed it down? :P

I disagree with Crix there. As i think Sarin posted someplace else about something or other concerning how many people get to DJK- not many do, and thats not just down to leadership. Those people just go inactive and fill up roster space, and althought i dont like to say it, i'm sure a few AWoL's survive the AWoL checks. Example: The EH. :P

I just think its more efficient to make the Consul's, Aediles and Quastor's want to drop the inactives.

A clan population cap would perhaps also force more people to go to the more lacking clans like CP (No offence to CP :P)

Halcyon

29-07-2007 14:39:28

I never closed down HQD. Try and get your history right :P

Adien Falaut

29-07-2007 15:26:22

What about going through the rouges and cleaning that section out as well?

Dalthid

30-07-2007 07:32:46

leave the Rogues alone, dillweed :P

I just think its funny that a "more lacking" clan is one that has 80+ assigned; when I was in clans, I would've loved to see that many on the roster, inactive or not :)

Adien Falaut

30-07-2007 12:43:04

:P it was just a thought.

Yeah I agree there it does show interest in the individual clan with numbers like that.

Tolter

30-07-2007 17:24:25

In some ways a cap might be good. Now, I'm not attacking Tal (yet) but if more people see that they are a better clan wouldn't the higher ranking/more active want to join that clan, while all the others are stuck with inactive lower ranking members?

But then again, it wouldn't be right for the MAA to deny a member's request to another clan saying "They already have enough people". I don't think so :P

Werdna Elbee

30-07-2007 17:39:29

People who think like that don't understand the loyalty of belonging to a clan. They won't fit into the more successful ones.

RevengeX

30-07-2007 20:42:10

Werdna: Agreed.

Clan "population caps" wouldn't contribute positively to the DJB.

Morgan

01-08-2007 15:40:29

It'd mean that a clan can only have so many people, which means instead of people transfering to the top clans- forces them to choose another clan.

So, not only does it supply clans which are doing poorly activity wise with new members, it evens out the clan populations. Not saying any clan names but we know how the last RoS went in one clans favour due to population. :P

Tell me how none of that is positive to the DJB as a WHOLE?

Khobai

01-08-2007 20:00:27

I would be better just to run events that dont favor clans with larger populations.

Kaine Mandaala

02-08-2007 00:31:37

You can either force a club wide member redistribution

-- OR --

Try recruiting from the Rogues to even them out.

Some rogues want to be active.

Adien Falaut

02-08-2007 15:24:42

Yeah that's what I meant before filter though the rouges and see who's still around wanting to come back as active members that should help out at least somewhat right?

Morgan

02-08-2007 21:33:17

EXACTLY, Khobs.

Halcyon

02-08-2007 22:53:57

Current Clan numbers, as of this posting

ARC - 106
CNS - 94
CP - 90
CSP - 115
TAL - 92
TAR - 95

If you want to talk about current competitions, check out overall placings for Clans. Biggest Clan isn't winning in every category, or overall right now.

If we want to talk about helping the DB as a WHOLE, I would much rather ensure new members are going to a Clan that actually takes the time to look after those newer members. Some Clans do it better than others, but so long as we are getting active new members, it does help the whole DB.

This isn't a "good" fix, as you don't know why there's a discrepancy between Clans. Why does one Clan have so many compared to another? It isn't just about who gets more, but who KEEPS more. Why do some Clan retain more active members? Why do some seem to lose a lot?

It's pretty clear that Big Clan doesn't automatically win you anything. ACTIVE Clans win you competitions. Active leadership makes for an active Clan.

More focus needs to be on the Clans and Houses themselves, instead of trying to fix entire DB processes.

Kaek

03-08-2007 01:03:32

On a side note, we do occasionally purge the database of inactive members with the big roster resets.

We haven't done one of those in a while so it might be a good time to do one after the GJW. That's up to the MAA, GM and Jac though.

Esca

03-08-2007 03:44:29

As much as I do agree about the purging of inactive members, there have been records of past members trying to finally come back only to realize that their dossiers have been deleted. So in essence, the purging could be viewed as a bad thing. Just a little two sense from someone who both supports and opposes purging.

``Esca

Morgan

03-08-2007 14:09:19

I shall purge thee!

*purges*

Tarax Kor

03-08-2007 15:16:18

I think this should be the Clan Population Capô:



On a more serious note, I think it's unnecessary. When you look at the size of a clan by its numbers, usually only 10 to 25% (at most) of that Clan is ever really active when it matters (such as during a GJW or RoS). On the same note, after each major engagement (which gouges which 10 to 20% of the membership is active/around) the rosters get cleaned, effectively making it silly to need a cap.

As for those that get cleaned, then come back sometime later and bitch about it? Well, they should have responded when the AWOL checks went out.

Scyrone

05-08-2007 15:52:05

There are members from the Rogues who do want to come back. I have had a rough time with activity here. And I think I have been to the rogues once. I spent some time there, and then came back to the DJB because I had the time.

Anyways, to the original point. Clan Populations caps would help with certain things such as all the good members going to Taldryan, but then again, it would force some members to go to Clans in which incredibly suck (no names). ;)

Morgan

06-08-2007 08:09:37

Thats the point isnt it. Going to clans that suck, and actually doing something constructive and making them not suck so much. :P

Shikyo Keibatsu

14-09-2007 23:05:07

I was actually curious about whether or not we were going to do a purge for the Brotherhood. Considering we're almost at 10,000 members now.

Jac Cotelin

15-09-2007 01:58:26

Total Membership: 3991

Don't go by the dossier #s -- most of them don't exist any more or are people who never activated their accounts.

We'll do a Super AWOL again eventually, but it's not high on the list of priorities. That was a shitload of work for me and the MAA and I have some other projects that need to be done first.

Jac

Shikyo Keibatsu

15-09-2007 01:59:54

And this, children, are why Buffalo Hunters are forced to find other jobs. :P. JK Jac