Versus 2 on 2

i dont know who would win they seem equal and both sides kept getting lucky in there battles in episode three Sidious was in the senate chamber with those chairs that he tossed around and Obi Won got the higher ground

Firstly, it should be Vader and Sidious. Anakin died about the same time as Old Macey. And secondly, Sidious pwned Yoda, and would have done the same to Obi in due time. Besides, on level playing ground, Ani would pwn Obi. In a way, Obi cheated. Had Ani been smart, he would have jus used the Force on some lava and shown Obi what it feels like. Then we'd see who needed a big black life-support-system-built-into-a-heavy-funny-smelling-black-shell-suit.

No Yoda and Sidious were as strong as each other anyway im talking a flat room nothing but each other to use the force on
:vader: + biwan: = :vader:

Ok, so Obi gets pwned, then Vader and Sidious team up on Yoda. Eventually, he'd die like a bitch, regardless of how good he is. Sidious took on four High Council members at once and pwned three of them in thirty seconds, and would have killed them all if he didn't need to decieve Ani. Sidious hits Yoda wit Lightning, Yoda's busy blocking, Ani cuts him to ribbons.

The answer to this question depends on which Darth Vader we're talking about.

* Pre-Suit, Anakin/Vader was quite the deulist, though it has been said that Obi-Wan was among the best the Jedi had. I still think Obi-Wan would catch Anakin off-guard and defeat him. Anakin was too driven by his emotions, and that was his ultimate downfall.

* Post-Suit Vader relied more on the Force. Though more in touch with keeping his emotion in check, he lacked the mobility of his former self. Obi-Wan surrendered, but I feel he would have been killed anyway. I don't imagine he was sparring with the droid in his home on Tattooine.

As for Yoda and Palpatine - They're equal, even though Palpatine likes to cheat.

You mispelling Obi-wan btw.

Obi-wan and yoda would win this fight no doubt.

First Obi-wan was the greatest Lightsaber master of the time and would have beat vader regardless not to mention yoda could drop Vader in minutes.

Second had it not been for the senate chamber and falling from the platform yoda would have probably beaten Sidious.
Yoda was far more powerful in the force them most realize being able to block and absorb the Emperors force lightning took remarkable control of the force.

There is a chance that one of them may die but in the end it would be Yoda or Obi-wan left standing.

Sidious never pwned Yoda, they never finished their battle, and in my opinion Obi-Wan and Anakin are even, pre or post suit.

If post-suit vader Obi-wan would kill him Vader got weaker when he got the suit.
Yoda and Sidious would kill each other I wish i put in Dooku

If post-suit vader Obi-wan would kill him Vader got weaker when he got the suit.
Yoda and Sidious would kill each other I wish i put in Dooku



Poll reset with new options.

Vader and Dooku -- between the two of them they have beat everybody except Sidious and Yoda and they have not been paired together for obvious reasons.

I stand by saying that Vader and Sidious would win. By Vader, I mean Anakin, as he was Darth Vader before the suit incident. Obi-Wan won against Vader because Vader made a stupid mistake. Besides, flat room, no throwables, Obi does not have that advantage. Vader would kill him, and then team up with Sidious to destroy Yoda. I don't think that even Yoda could stand up to Darth Sidious and the Chosen One.

thnx

Obi-wan beat Vader pre-suit, He was the reason why Vader needed a suit in the first place.

Obi-wan and Yoda would then fight Sidious. It would be pretty intense, but with Yoda's force capabilities and Obi-wans Soresu mastery, Sidious would wear down and be beaten.

I stand by saying that Vader and Sidious would win. By Vader, I mean Anakin, as he was Darth Vader before the suit incident. Obi-Wan won against Vader because Vader made a stupid mistake. Besides, flat room, no throwables, Obi does not have that advantage. Vader would kill him, and then team up with Sidious to destroy Yoda. I don't think that even Yoda could stand up to Darth Sidious and the Chosen One.



You say obi-wan would have lost because he didn't have the high ground?
Kenobi would have won anyway that just made the battle shorter otherwise it would have gone on much longer.
Not only Obi-wan was the greatest lightsaber master of the order at that time his knowledge of the force surpassed Vaders and it was only a matter of time before Vader over extended or made another "stupid" mistake and Ob-wan took advantage and finished him.

As for Yoda and Sidious in a flat room with out all the senate platforms Sidious is going down.
Yoda only fled because he fell and he knew the clones would be coming and without his lightsaber he couldn't fight them all.

Once vader was down Obi-wan would have helped yoda and Sidious would die.

Although Obi, and Yoda are a very powerful team you also have to take into effect that Darth Sidious is the Dark Lord of the Sith, Therefore he has an adept mastery of the force and with a saber. Therefore he would kill Obi, >:) and then sidious would defeat yoda.

You saw what he did to Mace Windu :w00t:. Plus Sidious could see the futer and saw Ani would come and therefore if anikan had not been coming Sidious would have just killed Windu. B)

Although Obi, and Yoda are a very powerful team you also have to take into effect that Darth Sidious is the Dark Lord of the Sith, Therefore he has an adept mastery of the force and with a saber. Therefore he would kill Obi,  >:)  and then sidious would defeat yoda.

You saw what he did to Mace Windu  :w00t:. Plus Sidious could see the futer and saw Ani would come and therefore if anikan had not been coming Sidious would have just killed Windu.  B)



Funny I remember Sidious having a fair amount of trouble fighting Yoda considering he could absorb and reflect force lightning and had as much knowledge of the force as Sidious no doubt.
I highly doubt that Windu had Sidious and if Anakin had not stopped Windu it was quiet obvious what was about to happen to Palpatine. Windu was the last Master of Vaapad.

It happens to us all man

I think Mace Windu and Yoda would kick ass. I mean, Mace practically killed Sidious, he just failed to realize that the true danger lie in Anakin. Yoda, well, he's Yoda. Sidious just barely managed to defeat him, if you even call it that, and big bad Ani better be glad Obi-Wan was sent after him instead of Yoda because if the green dude had gone after him the newly claimed Darth Vader wouldn't have lasted a few minutes. (Yoda would've just pushed him into the lava since unlike Obi-Wan he would've aimed to actually kill Ani)

Good point. Obi still sucks, though.

If there is a conflict, is the book or the movie considered canon?

I ask this because, according to the EP III book, Sidous purposefully put himself in jeopardy with Windu in order to present the chance to convert Anakin at that moment. That does not come across in the movie as much as it does in the book. If this is true the "OMG Windu pwns Sidious" comments need to be re-evaluated.

Further, when Anakin fought Dooku, the book leads me to believe that Sidious was "jamming" Dooku after Dooku had dealt with Obi-Wan, again so that Anakin would be guided fuirther down the path by killing Dooku.

I bring this two thing up because I always see on these boards everyone's opinion that Anakin was this total badass...and he was...to an extent. I believe one should keep in mind though, that Sidious was propping Anakin along in these two major instances and when he did not, as when Anakin fought Obi-Wan alone, things did not come out so well for Anakin.

Again, Anakin fought quite well in the Clone Wars. But, he really does not compare to the other Jedi such as Yoda, Obi-Wan, Dooku, or Sidious.

I believe Sidious and Dooku would beat any pair on the list above.

Of course, in a real fight, on any given day anyone can beat anyone. I am talking about eight or nine times out of ten though.

Books often change a lot of things. If I remember correctly in the Ep III book it has Obi-Wan as lastly quite a bit longer against Dooku, and that they fought a more planned out duel then in the movie. Of course, movies have time restraints and books do not. However, with Palpy making Anaking's opponents weaker may be true, but I don't really think he'd do it. If I really wanted to have an all powerful warrior then I'd want to make sure he could stand his ground against my less-then-perfect fakey I have at my side now. If Anakin couldn't defeat Dooku on his own, with or without training, then he didn't really deserve to be big bad Vader.

As with him losing to Obi, well, he got super cocky right there and complete neglected to think things true. Of course, all that heat and possible radiation from the lava river soaking into his brain could have something to do with it

Oh, I think when there's a conflict between the move and book then the movie takes place before the book, since the movies were officially writen by Mister Lucas. Even though half the time the books are better. Like, in the Ep III book the battle where Agen, Kit, and all them go to arrest Palpy is DO much cooler then the movie's version

As far as Windu goes, we know that in the movie Sidious did trick him. He was waiting for Ani. After Windu was disarmed(literally), Sidious cooked his ass. He could have kept fighting and eventually killed Windu. I don't know about you, but I think the sudden sag in his technique was a sure pointer for me. I mean, he goes from jumping around like a big, evil Yoda to duelling like Obi and Vader in ANH. Come on, man, he didn't even gradually get weaker, he just suddenly blew chunks. I mean, the dude stood up to Yoda. Yoda, man! He could pwn Windu. It would have bin like round 1 of Ani vs. Dooku. Sure, he'd put up a fight, but eventually he would have a miscellaneous body part removed and shoved up his- whoa, little too much to drink there.

Also, novelizations are inspired by movies. It has nothing to do with time restraints. Georgie shows him the script, and he is forced to write the background, the music, and the mood. That's why they're all so different.

In response to Aabsdu's comment about "If I really wanted to have an an all powerful warrior..." I do not think Sidious wanted an "all-powerful warrior." I think Sidious just wanted, among other things I am sure but primarily during the time represented by EPs 1-3, to be rid of the Jedi.

Sidious wanted an Empire. He also wanted the fall of the Jedi, the ultimate army, and the strongest Force-User on a leash. However, when Vader got stuck in the suit, it decreased his appeal. Getting rid of the Jedi was merely the final stroke of his masterpiece.

I think Vader and Maul would win. Vader just being prwtty good and same as Maul.

Vader and Maul were apprentice Sith, both of whom got owned by Obi. Ani might have had some chance, seeing how he was already a Jedi Knight when he fell.

SO was Sidious at one time, so was Obi (well he was an Apprentice at one time).

Obi was an apprentice when he killed Maul, so there wouldn't even be competition there. As far as Ani goes, too wild and bloodthirsty. No control whatsoever.

Good point Kal, but really the only reason Obi owned Maul was because Maul was being cocky after beating Qui Gon, and the only reason Ani lost is because he was stupid enough to jump up to Obi's level to try and get him.

I never understood all that "I've got the high ground" sh*t. Honestly, while that may make a lot of difference in regular combat between regular people, how did it matter in Force assisted lightsaber combat?

Couldn't Anakin pretty much jump as high as he wanted?

Hadn't they jumped up levels previously in exactly the same fight moments before?

Also, why couldn't that thing Anakin was riding go higher?

Also, why couldn't Anakin jump to the bank somewhere else then move to engage Obi-Wan?

I suppose it just had to happen and the movie was already either too long or too short or something or another that drove it.

That whole fight was so overdone, contrived and flat out goofy anyway.

Anytime I see someone spin in a swordfight I think WTF. All the opponent has to do is step forward and thrust. Not only that, if you are so much faster than your opponent so that you can spin before he can even thrust why not just go ahead and pwn him anyway? It's showbiz BS.

It reminds me of those people at karate tournaments that spin their staff and throw it in the air and cacth it and scream and yell when anyone I trained for a week who was in reasonable physical shape could tackle their ass and beat the snot out of them.

Last thought for now...remember when Anakin and Obi-Wan are standing about a foot and a half apart ond spinning their lightsabers, including behind their back? OMFG -- ROFL...Let's stand toe to toe and do kata with lightsabers and not even try to hurt each other...damn!!!

That's cool man. It's so raw. Yeah...right.

You make a compelling argument. However, think of it this way: If the fight didn't look like that, we'd have about ten second lightsaber duels. Now I don't know about you, but to me "thrust, slash, thrust, parry, slash, slash, thrust" gets boring after a while. If it's "Thrust, slash, parry, jump thirty feet into the air, spin, leap, throw something telekinetically, ping off of the wall and try to lop the other guy's head off before landing" it's alot more fun to watch. Besides, Lucas planned for it to be the "Golden Age of the Jedi," so if the combat was as simple as it was in the originals, that would mean that tens of thousands of years of Jedi training didn't go down the tube when almost every one of them was killed.

Now you tell me, does that make sense?

Your post gave me some insight. One could argue that the Jedi had become encrusted and overdone in every way, including thier style of "combat" such that it was time to put it all down the drain. Yeah, it makes some sense. Plus, from a RL perspective, that's what everyone expects now anyway since the advent of the "flying swordfight" genre of theater brought on by Chinese influence. I had been watching Chinese and Korean movies for years and always hoped "please do not ever let that flying sword fight stuff take over our movies." But it has, including Star wars.

You make a compelling argument. However, think of it this way: If the fight didn't look like that, we'd have about ten second lightsaber duels. Now I don't know about you, but to me "thrust, slash, thrust, parry, slash, slash, thrust" gets boring after a while. If it's "Thrust, slash, parry, jump thirty feet into the air, spin, leap, throw something telekinetically, ping off of the wall and try to lop the other guy's head off before landing" it's alot more fun to watch. Besides, Lucas planned for it to be the "Golden Age of the Jedi," so if the combat was as simple as it was in the originals, that would mean that tens of thousands of years of Jedi training didn't go down the tube when almost every one of them was killed.

Now you tell me, does that make sense?


LOL i'm sorry it just sounds funny the way you said that

I'll take that as a compliment.

I'll take that as a compliment.


Don't

whatever man I always have your girlfriend for comfort.

Only in your dreams man, only in your dreams.

At least I have her in dreams. You, on the other hand...

have her in real life

Not bad. You're actually learning, Arc.

I know it's fun